gatorback

[Guest]

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[northbkr1]

Alafia, Flatwoods, Trout Creek and Morris bridge. For those of you who don't know, you can get a season pass for Alafia. It's easier and a whole lot cheaper than paying everytime you go.

[northbkr1]

A petition is not what is needed, it's people. It's that simple. Want it open? All you have to do is start coming to work days so you can learn what it takes to fix it so we don't have to close it anymore. Like I said earlier it's not fair to have people who can't ride it fix it(post # 15). I know 30 or 40 people who ride it but never come to help or say they will come and never do. I have a lot of really cool trail we can build and will. Some easy and some hard, it's up to all of you. If the only people who come are beginner or intermidiate riders that's what we build. If I get enough people  who really want  to help open Gatorback, I will set up a workday just for that. Now the ball is in your court. Let's see if you really want it open.       Art

[Ken]

The season pass is also good for all the Florida State parks.

[Cyclopod]

A petition is not what is needed, it's people. It's that simple. Want it open? All you have to do is start coming to work days so you can learn what it takes to fix it so we don't have to close it anymore. Like I said earlier it's not fair to have people who can't ride it fix it(post # 15). I know 30 or 40 people who ride it but never come to help or say they will come and never do. I have a lot of really cool trail we can build and will. Some easy and some hard, it's up to all of you. If the only people who come are beginner or intermidiate riders that's what we build. If I get enough people  who really want  to help open Gatorback, I will set up a workday just for that. Now the ball is in your court. Let's see if you really want it open.       Art

Hi Art, This is in part what I was wondering.  If the trail is closed down, merely because of maintenance issues.  What I hear you are saying is that is the case!  As I've mentioned, a lot of us live a ways away, but, there are some of us that are ready to put the time in to help out.  I realize that it is easy to say some of us want to come out and that with time volunteers will flake out.  However, there are a couple of us that want to take charge and organize a crew (and do our best to keep a crew going).  Give me the choice of loosing Gatorback and put in a few hours a month, and I'll put in a few hours.  Gatorback and Moonscape are really the reason that I do the 2.5 hr drive to Alafia.  I'll even help out with the other projects the club has in store.

What is a decent sized crew to work on Gatorback? 
What kind of effort are we talking about (how many maintenance days). 
What kind of equipment will be supplied, and needed? 

We've heard from lots of riders who want to come out and do their part.  I'm ready to do my part in keeping a crew together.  We've already lost Razorback and the TOE, we don't want to loose out on any of this caliber of trails!

[steve]

Only one way to do it show up or shut up!

[northbkr1]

Thanks Cyclopod this is a great start. Send me an email at art@swampclub.org with your phone # so we can talk

[Garry]

Only one way to do it show up or shut up!

Amen

[dhwilliams]

Only one way to do it, show up or shut up!

Dave Williams, one of the "usual suspects" from Markham park MTB trails here.

It seems all parks that are volunteer maintained have the problem of many riders and few volunteers. Sorry to hear your problems with disrespectful  riders and Gator Back being closed. It must be a tough trail to maintain with fall lines that erode so badly coupled with difficult access and it does have a high risk factor for injury, even by the most experienced rider.

At Markham we cut the injury rate from 4 or 5 EMS visits a week to maybe 1 or 2 a month. We did this with ability level signs and an active 30 member IMBA certified mountain bike patrol.

We have been sued a few times mostly by inexperienced riders who ignore the signs and ride onto a trail above their ability and get hurt trying to ride the trail, rather than walking it out. We defend all suits aggressively and have a good record of success based on the signs and daily patrol reports.

I am also on the mountain bike patrol at Alafia and ride there monthly. It's like a holiday away from Markham. The trails are always in amazing condition thanks to the Alafia "usual suspects". We almost always come across helmetless riders with the same comeback "we are just riding the novice trails".... then how come you are on Rock garden?? Riding without a helmet is like birth control for the shallow end of the gene pool.

The good news is that as of October 2006 mountain biking was added to the Florida Equine Law as an inherently dangerous activity. The law says "if we provide you with a piece of land to ride on and you fall down and injure yourself you cannot hold us, the landowner responsible". What it doesn't say is "unless the landowner can be proved negligent".

So, if you build a trail, maintain it as a natural area, sign it appropriately, and do not place hazards on the trail it will be difficult to prove negligence and the Equine Law will (hopefully) prevail.

We share similar problems and it's good to share solutions to protect the trails for future generations of MTN bike riders.

Ride on. Dave    turnerburner@bellsouth.net

[Cyclopod]

Just spoke with Art today and went over a few details.  I'm a bit long on detail but bear with me.

First thing is that the work day will not be on February 2nd.  The Croom FTF is held on the same day so that will be a bad day and Boyette will have a work day soon after, where they will be using all their tools as well.  While the workdays are usually on the first Saturday of the month he is planning on scheduling a special workday just for Gatorback sometime between Feb to March.  He will get back to me on exactly what day, but keep checking in for updates.

Next, there is a plan to overhaul Gatorback.  No need to panic.  For the most part Gatorback will stay the same.  There will be a casualty.  The first and biggest drop will be taken out of the route.  There is good news, the trail will be extended.  Also, Art promised that the plans, including the extension, are meant to keep the trail challenging.

Art has a budget of $1500 to get material (i.e. wood and tools)  just for Gatorback.  He's estimating that we need about 20 people to come out to put in a couple of work days to have the trail ready.  The good news is that he has about 6-8 people (maybe more) from his end ready to come out to help.  Right now, from our end, we can at least match that and the more people who come out the sooner the trail will open.

There will be instruction as well.  People will be there to explain how things should be done.  The best part is that all we need to bring is ourselves.  Entry in the park will be free to volunteers on workdays.  They will have food and drinks provided.  We do have to RSVP so they can get enough food and have tools ready.

This is what I got from our conversation.  I didn't take notes so I may have forgotten a few details.  So what do you guys say?  Our goal is 20 volunteers.  Right now we have about half that much.

[Ken]

Art, Cyclopod,
      That's great news guys. Let me know what days and if at all possible I will be there. Baseball's just starting up right now, and if I remember Art's son plays, so he knows how hectic that can be at times, but I'd really like to help out!

[slowfatguy]

keep us posted on when this workday is going to happen, I know I can beat up/badger a few others in to showing up. I need to get with Art inperson sometime, I plan on spending a good bit of time at Alafia this summer, but due to my crazy work schedule can't always make it the first Saturday.

[Endo70]

I would like to help out also. Ive only ridden ( or hike and bike)it once but would like it to stay as a goal to work up to. Please post workdates asap.

[YaMon]

You can count me in. The only dates I cannot help is Feb 5-12th. I will be attending the Jamaican Fat Tire Festival !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[eclark]

This is the word I've been hoping for!  Lets keep gatorback hard.  I will be there for the workday and hopefully will be part of the group to keep it open regularly.  Keep us posted on the date.

[Cyclopod]

This is exactly the response we were hoping for.  I've been posting on a number of forums and we'll soon get enough volunteers to get what we need done.  Keep the responses coming.  As soon as we figure on a work date it will be posted.