Author Topic: removing obstacles?  (Read 13801 times)

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Offline slowfatguy

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Re: removing obstacles?
« Reply #75 on: May 10, 2008, 12:53:09 PM »
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Dude, you just don't get it. It's done, it's over. Everytime you bring this back up it just seems like you are trying to rub people's noses into it. See what I'm getting at? When people volunteer their time to do trail work, sometimes they feel they should have some input. Where else are they supposed to voice that opinion? Alot of trail can be altered in a month. Anyway, let's take your advice and shut up and ride! ;D
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Offline eclark

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Re: removing obstacles?
« Reply #76 on: May 10, 2008, 01:19:52 PM »
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Hey all,
  As the op on this thread, I really just wanted to know what happened  Now I know, but it is done.  Sorry to start all the rucus.  I will be at the next workday, and see people I have worked with before.  Sorry to everyone that worked hard on them that I b****hed about the trails, but I think alot of people have the same opinion.  Is the post close to a record yet?  #77 here...

Offline Garry

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Re: removing obstacles?
« Reply #77 on: May 10, 2008, 04:45:40 PM »
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I've held my tongue for a bit now trying to let this go. A few of the guys that were here complaining I have seen out doing trailwork, on many different trails. If someone never opens their mouth to say something, how will anyone ever know that their are people out there that want harder trails?

Show up for a workday, have some input, or understanding of what goes into making a sustainable trail, or harder trail, or the balance of hard easy trails.  There is usually something for everyone, and we try to keep a good balance of them.  After that there is the never ending task of keeping all of those trails groomed and open.  We need bodies to do that.  We had 18 people show up for 24 miles of trails.  Would 19 have helped?  Yep.  25?  Oh yes.

Offline slowfatguy

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Re: removing obstacles?
« Reply #78 on: May 10, 2008, 06:27:04 PM »
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With all due respect Garry, I was at Alafia this morning trimming Gatorback and part of Moonscape. :) I was at the Alafia workday last weekend. :) I was at the big workday that got Gatorback reopened. :) Before anyone asks, yes I co-ordinated with Art before I went out this morning. I've put in alot of hours working on other trails in the past. I love riding, I love our trails. But it seems like everywhere you look lately something is missing, being taken out to make the trail easier. Even when there are other options. It's not just the SWAMP trails either, so I'm not trying to point fingers. What happened to becoming a better rider and challenging your abilities? I fully understand that sometimes changes need to be made, and trails need to be maintained to the level rider they were designed for. The last regular workday I kept hearing people talk about how this or that is impossible to make and how it should be changed. There is nothing out there that is impossible! I'm fat and slow and can ride everything out there clean. Shouldn't there be something out there that is tough? I don't mean dangerous, I mean challenging! I know there are things that the land managers don't want and need approval and what not, that's not what I'm referring to. Is there ever a club meeting or anything? I don't seem to communicate my thoughts very well online.

And before someone brings it up, yes I am a paying member of SWAMP and IMBA.
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Offline Garry

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Trail issues
« Reply #79 on: May 10, 2008, 07:45:01 PM »
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In response to  Re: removing obstacles?


One of the bad things about e-mail and posts is that the intended point of view, message, and tone is almost always lost.  Never fails.

Actually , my previous response was not pointed at you personally, but more in general to a snippet of what was in your post that I felt pertained to everyone in general.  I should have pulled that out as a quote and responded to just that as that. 

Many times it is said that we who build and maintain the trails do not make, or keep, some feature that someone wants to keep.  My point that I failed to make was - for those folks - to come out and join us on some workdays and see just what goes into giving up ones free time to build, repair, reroute and constantly fix the same problem area over and over again.  There again, that is not pointed at any one person, just throwing it out there where I had a chance to comment.  Sorry it took on a piercing blow.

After more than a few years you decide it’s time for you to ride and enjoy the trails as well, so you start looking for ways to make the trails hold up to weather, over use, skid braking, dragging brakes down drops, and damnit, people pulling features out of the trails.  You find ways to make it more difficult for them to take features out, but that is quite time consuming to plan, design and do.  Something is going to get passed over, and if it gets passed over enough times, then it is made into something easier to maintain so you don’t have to think about it anymore.  That’s where you end up pissing people off.

If 20-30 people showed up on any given workday and helped make it right that would be sweet.  With so many miles of trails to take care of there is not enough time in a 3 or 4 hour block to do everything that needs to be done.  Obviously there has to be someone in charge for each work crew, and each of those have to be on the same page as what needs to be done and how.  A few folks have taken trail building classes and have been heavily involved in trail building and maintaining them that there are now a handful of folks who can share in this job.  Trouble is they aren’t always available at the same time.  There are so very many opinions of what makes the trail right, difficult - yet sustainable, and appealing to the masses.  Someone is always going to be put off by what you do.

Now, you look at who comes out to the workdays and puts in their time week after week, month after month, year after year, and listen to their input of what the trail should be like.  Sure, you want a trail that serves as many people as possible, but if you make a bunch of difficult trails what B+, A riders, Racers, and Extreme riders want, the people who either can’t, or don’t wish to ride those trails don’t show up to the workdays to build and maintain trails they do not ride.  If those people do not show up to the official workdays, then there are only like 3 - 5 people who do show up and the only thing you can get done is trim as many face slappers out of the way as you can so you can at least ride something.  A vicious circle I tell ya’, a vicious circle.

Hope to see ya’lls name on the next workday - which ever trail system it may be at.  ;-)

G
« Last Edit: May 10, 2008, 08:08:31 PM by Garry »

Offline slowfatguy

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Re: removing obstacles?
« Reply #80 on: May 10, 2008, 09:00:03 PM »
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Well said Garry. We should get together for a ride, lunch and a beer. I'll buy. ;)
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Offline Coach

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Re: removing obstacles?
« Reply #81 on: May 10, 2008, 10:59:33 PM »
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Did someone say beer!  Bring a keg to a workday and see how many people show up.  You may only get an hour of work out of them, but you'd definitely hit your 20-30 person quota!
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Offline northbkr1

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Re: removing obstacles?
« Reply #82 on: May 16, 2008, 02:03:03 PM »
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Wow have I missed a lot. I have been busy. I'm keeping my mouth shut. How about ME, I like BEER TOO. I wanna go.
Art

Offline slowfatguy

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Re: removing obstacles?
« Reply #83 on: May 16, 2008, 09:16:57 PM »
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You too Art! :D
Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.